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Note: In the following pages the book Spiritual Letters is mentioned, by Beas. Since Secret History was originally written, Beas is now claiming many of these letters are not original, that some unknown person whom originally read the letters re wrote them. This has not been verified directly from Beas, but it was always obvious from the historical mistakes this ghost writer inserted. -- Dr. David Lane on Kirpal's First Hand Experience-- For a large number of seekers, Kirpal Singh's promising offer was tantalizing proof of his competency. However, for a small number of followers, it prompted some confusion, since Kirpal's master Sawan Singh did not make the same claims during his tenure. As one Ruhani Satsang initiate explained to Kirpal Singh: "I know two initiates who in the beginning read Spiritual Gems and they found contradictions in it with Your teachings--very minor ones, but it created a lot of problems in their mind." [*NOTE: Heart to Heart Talks, Volume II , op. cit., page 157. *] Later on in the conversation the (presumably) same disciple expressed his surprise when learning that Sawan Singh's followers rarely received inner experiences at the time of initiation: "I was reading With the [sic] Great Master in India by Julian Johnson. And I was amazed in one section it says that the Master [Sawan Singh] gave initiation to over seven hundred people and out of that only two saw Light--only two saw Light!" [*NOTE: Ibid. *] The disciple's amazement was well founded, since Kirpal Singh had basically forged new ground, breaking precedent even with his own guru. Sawan Singh, for instance, actually argued against the need for giving firsthand experiences at the time of initiation. Argues Sawan Singh: The view that one must see something at the time of Initiation or he would never be able to see anything later is wrong [my emphasis]. Experience also does not support it. Everyone is running his own course of life, which is different from all others. No two persons are alike in habit, form and thought. All are at different stages of development. At Initiation, they cannot be expected to behave alike. Only few [my emphasis] see anything then. The majority [my emphasis] take time, some weeks, some months and some years. All are not equally keen. [*NOTE: Sawan Singh, Spiritual Gems (Beas: Radha Soami Satsang Beas, 1974), page 87. *] Malik Radha Krishna Khanna, an initiate of Sawan Singh and a close associate of Kirpal Singh, attests to the differences between both gurus' approaches to initiation: I sat in at many initiations, and sometimes he [Sawan Singh] would ask me to drill the new initiates while they were learning the five charged Names. He would go away and leave me there. At the end, he never [my emphasis] asked who had seen this or heard that. That is something Maharaj Kirpal Singh Ji had started [my emphasis]. [*NOTE: "Reminiscences: At the Feet of the Great Hazur," Sat Sandesh (April 1978), page 30. *] ---------------------- ....Post on the Net from a club below about Kirpal....... Kirpal was a moron 7/25/01 1:49 pm RS Studies Club post protoast777 All what is below is 100% TRUE! 1. He used to pick his nose in public satsang in front of everyone. 2. He used to spit into a spitoon in public satsang, grossing everyone out. 3. He used to clear his throat and rasp like a gorilla in public Satsang. 4. He was often very gruff and mean. Many people would have an interview with him and he would often treat them like shit and even make women cry with his gruffness. 5. He talked like a baboon and nobody could understand what the hell he was saying. He should have had berlitz language training and then he would have spoken some clear english for once in his life. 6. His target audience was about a grade 1 level. If you disagree, read 'Morning Talks', a real sophisticated tome that one. You need to have read "dick and jane" as a prerequisite to get through that one. 7. He was boring, repeating himself over and over and over, giving the same sleeper talks everywhere he went. He repeated the same old lame phrases over and over like a parrot, and merely recombined them into different combinations everwhere he went. Read anything he wrote and you will see this is true. Boring and unimaginative. 8. He would many times act crazy and ask "are you initiated?" even to his group leaders. 9. He was totally unpredictable, one minute smiling and joking and the next minute ripping into someone. He was so unpredictable that you never knew when he was going to blow up at you. A loose cannon ready to blow up at any time. 10. He generated fear in people. Many people would not want to sit near him but at the back of the room so he wouldn't treat them like shit if they were within his eyesight range. If anyone is HONEST reading this they will nod their head. I know of people who spent time with him who thought he was very gruff and nasty, blowing up at them for hardly any reason whatever. He had very little patience with anyone. 11. Indian people would bring their diaries to him and he would throw them on the ground. He would hardly ever show respect even to his own people. 12. He was very gruff and mean. He made a lot of people ANGRY at him for the way he treated them. 13. I know of people who are still angry at him for the way he treated them like shit for no reason. 14. If you were RICH that is a different story. Then you were respected. ............. Kirpal tells how Sawan passed power to him Kirpal Singh then describes the event that he would later declare was integral to the succession process: the transmission of "the life impulse" from the eyes of the Living Guru to his successor. In his 1949 account Kirpal Singh writes: "Hazur steadily kept gazing for three or four minutes into my eyes, and my eyes, in silent wonderment, experienced an indescribable delight which infused intoxication down to the remotest core of my entire body - such as was never before experienced in my whole life." [Brief Life Sketch of Hazur Baba Sawan Singh. Ibid.] In 1955 he wrote, "The authority of giving initiation into the beyond and contacting with the Word, which he vouchsafed to me verbally on October 12, 1947, was thus completely transferred while going. The intoxication of that glance is still the life of my soul." [Message on the death anniversary of Hazur Baba Sawan Singh Ji Maharaj. April 2, 1955] (Probably c. Ruhani) ........... ---------- Darshan lies about women gurus, benefiting himself------------- From The Radhasoami Tradition by David Lane, Chapter 4 http://vm.mtsac.edu/~dlane/rs4.html Note: If you ignore Lane's horrible Beas section (which he probably would not agree with himself now) this was a good book . In two letters written in September of 1974, just a month after his father's demise, Darshan Singh explained the circumstances behind his appointment. The first letter, dated September 26, 1974, was sent to Tricholan Singh Khanna, Kirpal Singh's first and foremost representative in the United States. My nomination as My Beloved Father's Spiritual Successor derives circumstantial support from the fact that a woman could not be so nominated according to Sant Mat tradition. Such a thing never happened throughout the ages. My Beloved Father had taken care that I imbibe the qualities which would be helpful in carrying on the Satsang work. I have, under the circumstances, no hesitation in declaring myself as the Spiritual Successor of His Holiness Maharaj Kirpal Singh Ji in conformity with His wishes and shall carry on the Satsang work to the best of my ability. . . I am sorry to find that Mr. Sirrine concluded from his talk with Tai Ji (Bibi Hardevi) and her supporters that the Master had not nominated anyone as His Spiritual Successor. [*NOTE: There is an interesting sidelight here to Darshan Singh's letter. He claims that "a woman could not be so nominated according to Sant Mat tradition." The problem with this statement, though, is that it directly contradicts the historical evidence that Shiv Dayal Singh's wife, Radhaji, was appointed to serve as a guru, and did, in fact, conduct initiations. Furthermore, in the lineage of Soami Bagh gurus, Maheshwari Devi (Buaji Saheb), a female, was the fourth recognized master at Agra. It is also known that the late Baba Faqir Chand nominated several women to serve as initiating gurus. T.S. Khanna also makes the same theological and historical claims concerning women when he wrote, "In the whole history of Sant Mat (Path of the Masters) in India, no woman has ever attained the position of a spiritual leader or guide. This did not happen in the case of the ten Sikh Gurus, nor at Dyal Bagh [sic] or Swamibagh Agra [sic], not at Dera Baba Jaimal Singh at Beas." See Truth Uncovered: Re--Successor To Great Master Kirpal Singh Ji (privately circulated booklet, November 1974). Although Khanna is historically wrong in his allegations (as we already mentioned, Soami Bagh's fourth guru was a woman), it appears that his view on women is based upon Kirpal Singh's testimony. For instance, in Spiritual Elixir, Volume II (Delhi: Ruhani Satsang, 1972), when Kirpal Singh was asked, "Why do the Great Masters on earth always take the form of man?" He responded: " The Masters claim that there is only one Male gender amongst the souls,and He generally manifests on the chosen human Pole of the Living Master. It is a Divine Law which cannot be questioned by mortals. " [Page 33.] Kirpal Singh, Darshan Singh, and T.S. Khanna's claim raises several interesting historical, sociological, and theological issues which are beyond the scope of our study. *] Although Darshan Singh does not mention her by name, it is obvious from the previous excerpt that he is denouncing Madam Hardevi's claim for the gaddi at Sawan Ashram, since, as he claims, "a woman could not be so nominated according to Sant Mat tradition." Darshan Singh is also disappointed that Reno Sirrine has sided with her and concluded that Kirpal Singh did not leave a spiritual successor. ........... I do not like to say anything about the activities of Sardar Kirpal Singh's group, called Ruhani Satsang. . . . Since you have inquired, you are entitled to an answer, so I will simply add that the Great Master [Sawan Singh] never did appoint him as His Successor. He appointed Sardar Bahadur Maharaj Jagat Singh Ji, in a witnessed and recorded Will, to carry on all His Spiritual Work. If anybody else is bold enough to assert himself as the Great Master's Successor, then I can simply leave it to the sagacity of the seekers to judge his claim. The Great Master's Representatives in the foreign countries also have photostatic copies of the documents proving Successorship, and the one nearest you will be glad to show them to you on request. As regards S. Kirpal Singh, let him say or do anything he likes. Sooner or later he will have to render account for his actions. You have been given the key at the time of Initiation and can satisfy yourself as to whether or not he is a true Master. It would not be in good taste for me to go into detail, but I will say this much, that the Great Master, Maharaj Sawan Singh Ji, never gave him permission to initiate anyone, and duly appointed Sardar Bahadur Maharaj Jagat Singh Ji as His Successor by a legally executed Will, in writing and duly witnessed, so as to leave no doubt about this matter. If you care to have more information, you may contact your Representative, who has a photostatic copy of the documents concerned and can explain the whole situation to you. If you like, you may also contact Dr. Pierre Schmidt in Geneva, Switzerland, as he was one of the witnesses to the Will along with me and others, and was daily with the Great Master during the last four months of His life on this earth.
To better clarify his nomination as Satguru, Kirpal Singh published a booklet on his guru's life and teachings in English in 1949 which explained in detail how he was appointed. But in so doing, Kirpal Singh was calling into serious question the succession at Dera. For instance, in A Brief Life-Sketch of Hazur Baba Sawan Singh Ji Maharaj , Kirpal Singh clearly implies in four different places [*NOTE: See pages 11, 12, 15, and 18. *] that he alone was appointed to carry on his master's mission. On page 15 of the booklet, Kirpal Singh quotes his master as saying, "The mission of spirituality can only be carried on successfully by one [my italics] adept in spirituality." Moreover, Kirpal Singh implies that some of Sawan Singh's relatives and close disciples were spiritually blind. Indeed, Kirpal Singh cites at least five different episodes where Sawan Singh's family and/or close associates misunderstood their guru's wishes. Kirpal Singh argues throughout the text that he alone was capable of understanding the sublime and mystical ways of his master. Below are a few examples of Kirpal Singh's slightly veiled criticisms of Sawan Singh's inner circle: [Page 12] In those very days, one night Hazur mentioning His inner esoteric experiences remarked: "The sun has risen high. Can the people of Jullundur also see this sun?" The relatives and friends sitting nearby were ignorant of this secret expression . [My italics.] The opinion of [the] doctor in charge was also, like others beside Him, that Hazur's brain does not work properly on account of His illness. A little later at night when I went to Him, Hazur repeated the same question addressing me: "Kirpal Singh! The sun has risen high. Can the people of Jullundur see this sun?" I replied, "Yes Hazur, the sun has risen high--and not only the people of Jullundur but also those living in England or America who will traverse to inner planes can see this sun." Thereupon Hazur said: "Thou hast correctly answered my question." [*NOTE: Page 12. Dr. Pierre Schimdt, who attended Sawan Singh during his last four months, has a different interpretation than Kirpal Singh of this same event. In April of 1948, Schimdt wrote: "I feel I must relate two instances that revealed Him [Sawan Singh] as a Master even during this period of grave distress: 1. Some weeks before His death the Master asked to be brought some water from Jullundur, about 40 kilometers from the Dera, and when it was brought He asked why they had gone to collect it. Another evening He said to us, "Look at the light which shines in Jullundur" although there was only a slight glow over the city. I thought these were indications of delirium such as is met with in uraemia. Another day He said "Look at this house in which I now live, it is disintegrating and falling in ruins. We must leave the Dera and go to Jullundur. Quickly, buy a new house"! This seemed to be symptomatic of a state of weakness and mental obnubilation which comes paroxsmically in such conditions. But later we realized what He meant, for it was His Way of indicating His successor, who came from Jullundur: It was to tell us that henceforth the light would come from there and that He had finished His task, for Sardar Bahadur Jagat Singh was born at Jullundur. [My italics.] See Radha Soami Satsang Bulletin Number X for further information. *] [Pages 12-13] Similarly Hazur made a mention of several hidden secrets but those around Him were hardly able to grasp what Hazur was hinting at--this being a subject familiar to those only who are practical in-lookers and spiritually skilled. What, therefore, could other poor fellows know about them. [Page 15] (Spirituality) cannot be entrusted to a blind person. Whoever has a desire to find me out can reach me within through one who is linked with me. You will not find me in the company of those who are after the possessions of the world. Be not deceived by such people. . . . I do not dwell in the midst of mayaic insects. Go to some selfless being who is after me and lives for me and is not after possession of Deras. . . . [Page 18] Throughout the period of His illness Hazur said many times: "If a person proficient in Bhajan and Simran sits by me, I feel comforted and relieved. Therefore those who come to me or sit near me should do Simran." Accordingly, at the time of appearance of this symptom of "fluttering of the body" Hazur again spoke several times in these words: "If the person who has to do the work of spirituality after I depart, comes and sits by me, my trouble will be gone." To comply with this--evidently the last wish of the Master--the near relatives of Hazur came and sat in Bhajan and Simran one by one, by the side of bed of Hazur, but there was no relief whatever in the fluttering symptom of Hazur's body. On the morning of 1st April, 1948, it was extremely benevolent of Hazur to afford a chance to this humble servant--of course through the assistance of a lady in nursing service of Hazur--to be by the side of the Master, in seclusion, for about ten or fifteen minutes. . . . After the prayer [Kirpal Singh prayed for his guru's health] when I opened my eyes, Hazur's body was in a state of perfect repose. On several occasions, Kirpal Singh implied that the successors at the Dera--Jagat Singh and Charan Singh--only had the "seat," not the power. An incident retold in the book, Heart to Heart Talks, Volume II , reveals Kirpal Singh's position with regard to the Dera and its successors: It so happened here in India that a man was suffering greatly on account of cancer. He could not sleep, even for a moment. He was fortunately, or unfortunately, related to me, Gurdial Singh. So Baba Charan Singh went over there. The sick man asked, "Will you kindly help me?" Charan Singh answered, "Well, I can't do anything." As Gurdial Singh was related to me--my brother's daughter was married to his son--she dragged me there. They wanted me to put my hand on him. He said, "Will you help me?" I told him, "Baba Charan Singh has been with you. Why did you not request him?" I did request him but he said, "I can't do anything." So I was forced to put my hand on him, you see, and all trouble was relieved. [*NOTE: Heart to Heart Talks, Volume II (Delhi: Ruhani Satsang, 1976), page 80. *] Further on in the same book, Kirpal Singh explains the difference between his mission and the Beas successors after Sawan Singh: The other day I gave initiation to six hundred and fifty three people. All saw Light--about two hundred saw the Master's Form. The teachings at Beas are the same, but the words given at initiation are not charged [his emphasis]. That is the difference [my emphasis]. [*NOTE: Ibid., pages 157-158. *] The previous excerpt is very telling since Kirpal Singh says that the difference between him and Charan Singh is that he has the spiritual charging and the Beas leader does not. In other words, Kirpal Singh is claiming that he alone is genuine, and that he is genuine by virtue of inner, spiritual power. -----------ELVIS PRESLEY---------------- It was reported on a major television network in 2005, by his wife and daughter, that Elvis Presely practised Surat shabda Yoga under Paramahansa Yogananda. A photo was shown of him meditatating at Mt. Washington, near Los Angeles. Also, many occult books were shown he was reading. Now days, Shania Twain was reported to be a Thakar initiate mistakenly by a major tabloid. She is believed to be a Beas initiate. --------------------------- --------------------------- --------------------------- "I, S. Charan Singh Grewal s/o S. Harbans Singh Grewal, aged 74 years am making this will in regard to the spiritual affairs of the Society, Radha Soami Satsang Beas while in the full possession of my wits. I am making this Will in accordance with the wishes of Hazur Mahraj Baba Sawan Singh Ji Mahraj and my predecessor. I have served the Sangat whole-heartedly nto the best of my ability for nearly forty years. I have received in great measure the love, faith. and esteem of the entire sangat, of sewadars and my staff members of which it would be difficult to find a parallel in this world. I am deeply grateful for their co-operation and support. I appoint Sh. Gurinder Singh Dhillon s/o Sh. Gurmukh Singh Dhillon of Moga as my spiritual sucessor as ordered by Hazur Maharaj Baba Sawan Singh Maharaj. He will be the Sant Satguru as well as the Patron of Radha Soami Satsang Beas and will have the authority of giving initiation (NAM). He will also be the Patron of Maharaj Jagat Singh Medical Relief Society. I have made this Will in accordance with the wishes of Hazur Maharaj Baba Sawan Singh and I hope that my wishes as expressed in this will be duly honored by the entire sangat, all my family members and members of the Society. Dated 5/30/90, (Signed) Charan Singh Paul Twitchell ECKANKAR and Kirpal Comments In the following excerpt from Hearts-to-Heart Talk number 5 given on Sept. 11, 1970, c. Ruhani, Kirpal Singh agrees with Paul Twitchell's claim that Kirpal dictated The Tiger's Fang to him "inside" when Kirpal was in India and Twitchell in Washington, DC: Question: Too much fakery and too much commercialism? Master: Yes, yes. Too much propaganda. I tell you one American was initiated by me - I’ve got the initiation report in his own handwriting. Then he wrote to me, "The Master’s Form appears to me inside." That Form used to speak to him, dictate to him, inside. And all that dictation was put into a book and the manuscript was sent to me in 1963. Then later on he started a new movement. Question: Yes, I’ve heard about him. Master: Later he sent me another letter, "Return my book, The Tiger’s Fang." That is what such-like people will do. They had some little thing, and got stuck fast there. Now he’s carrying on propaganda. He says he was never initiated by me. He was initiated in 1955. Some people get stuck fast on the way. This little ego is very difficult to get rid of unless there’s some kind of protection. This is a living example. He has written other books. I need not mention his name. Question: I don’t think he mentions Your name either. Master: I don’t think he would. Why say things about anyone? If any man does well, all right. I returned his book. That was dictated by me on inner planes, and that’s all right. He changed that book before printing; where he mentioned my name, he changed it to another guru’s name. So that is the fate of these people. People are fed up with these Masters, gurus, and sadhus. Why? Only for this reason. Swami Ji's Turban Gift to Jaimal ???? Conflicting statements of Kirpal and Beas. Kirpal Version of Turban Kirpal has Radhaji, wife of Swami Ji, giving Swami Ji's turban to Jaimal, long after Swami Ji died. Jaimal, A Great Saint, page 59, Kirpal Singh, 1973 edition. Beas Version of Turban From "Last Commandments Of Swami Ji Maharaj" (1818-1878), an excerpt from "Spiritual Letters," published by Radha Soami Satsang Beas, paragraph 19, Swami Ji Maharaj is telling Baba Jaimal Singh Ji: "This is our last meeting. Now I shall go away to Param Dham (Eternal Home), after completing my life's pilgrimage. I have made you my beloved and my own RUP (self or form). " Bhai Chanda Singh then requested that Satsang be started in the Punjab. Swami Ji Maharaj replied: "This request has been accepted by Akal Purush, and this task has been allotted to Baba Jaimal Singh." Then Swami Ji Maharaj gave His own turban to Baba Ji as Prashad and ordered Him to go and preach Nam in the Punjab. ------ The Times of India DERAS EMERGING AS PARALLEL AUTHORITY KS Dhaliwal, Times News Network Jalandahar: The dera culture is spreading like poision in the whole of the state, more so in Doaba. The deras are also virtual vote banks and are patronised by politicians. The deras in turn patronise intellectuals and get them to write books in their favour. These intellectuals are connected with prominent universities and are never short of money as the deras influence extends into newer and newer spheres. Political observers feel the deras may soon come to dominate various state institutions to emerge as a parallel authority. The dera of Baba Piara Singh Bhaniara which shot into the news because of its links with prominent political leaders was only the tip of the iceburg. Almost all the famous Dalit deras, according to sources, have links with politcal parties of all hues. CONGRESS CHIEF SONIA GANDHI'S VISIT TO THE BEAS DERA A FEW WEEKS BACK SEEMS TO ENDORSE THIS VIEW. The visit was kept a closely guarded secret and not even prominent Congress leaders were allow to go near the dera on that Sunday morning, sources reveal. Chiranjilal Nar, author of Sangramiya lithas, a history of revolutionaries from the times of the Sikh Gururs till 1947, says "THE DERAS ARE BECOMING BUSINESS CENTRES. Recently a prominent dera near Jalandhar was sold to a Sant from the Majha region. Who knows where he got the money from, but he paid over Rs 50 lakh to buy the dera. It must be a profitable cnetre, otherwise why should he buy it." Dalit thinkers and leaders are worried by the spread of Dalit deras. LR Balley, author of several books of Dalit conscousness says: 'The socalled Sants running these deras in Doaba are the greatest impediment to the Dalit cause. Moreover they are becoming an obstacle in the way of scientific and rational thought.' Dalit short story writer, Bhagwant S. Rasoolpuri, says, 'These deras have taken the wind out of the sails of the Dalit movement. In the name of ad-dharamk, a movement started by famous Gaddarite Mangoo Ran Mogowalia, way back in 1925, they are misleading the people into believing in miracles." Bharpur Singh, member SGPC says: "The dera culture is eroding the Sikh rehad maryada (code of conduct). There was a uniformity in this code that kept the entire community together". Dal Khalsa spokesman Kanwarpal Singh, said" "We condemn the dera culture as it is against the basic Siokh rehat maryada. Most of the deras have come up on public land anre are encroachments. But the government has no influence on them as they want votes" The website is TimesofIndia.Indiatimes.com/articleshow.asp?.art_id=829898541 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Mastana Ji In November of 2002, The Times of India reported the person in charge of Mastana Ji's ashram killed the editor of a newspaper for reporting on the activites there. Mastana ji was an unathorized successor of Sawan Singh in 1948. http://www.expressindia.com/ie/daily/19980718/19951284.html bottom half of the page From the article: ...Sonia offers her prayers at a dera in Beas DHARMENDRA RATAUL AMRITSAR, NOVEMBER 5: In what is being touted as a major political move prior to the state assembly elections, the All India Congress Committee president, Sonia Gandhi, today visited the Radha Soami headquarters based at Beas, about 30 kms from here. The dera has always attracted the attention of the political parties at the time of elections. This time around, in a bid to do well in the elections, the Congress took the lead by arranging a visit of the party's national president. Although political observers confirmed the visit, insiders in the party claim that the visit was an entirely 'private affair'. The observers further say that the visit will have far-reacing political ramifications, especially when a close fight is being predicted. Sonia Gandhi, accompanied by Moti Lal Vora, in-charge Punjab affairs and party's senior leader, Natwar Singh, landed at the dera's private helipad at 11.30 am, amid high security and flew back to New Delhi at 2.30 pm. The whole exercise was attempted to be kept a secret and no mediaperson, even the local leaders, leaving aside party MP R.L. Bhatia and state president Capt Amarinder Singh were allowed to meet her. ''This was done at the request of the functionaries of the dera, who did not want to make it a political affair, and wanted to keep it low key,'' state a senior party leader, while talking to The Indian Express. Highly placed sources in the party revealed that the visit had been arranged by Capt Amarinder Singh after a frenetic three-month long effort, after he had received reports that senior BJP and Shiromani Akali Dal leaders were also trying to make a similar move. ''The party leaders had earlier also sought the blessings of the dera. Indira Gandhi, Narasimha Rao, Pranab Mukherjee and the late Rajesh Pilot had been regular visitors here,'' stated a senior Congress leader. Capt Amarinder Singh admitted that the visit was being planned for the last many months, however, he denied that the party expected any political gains out of the visit. ''There is no political motive in the visit. Sonia wanted to visit the place, and it was her personal affair,'' he said. Observers, however, disagree and say that the visit had been planned by the Captain, who is considered close to the present head of the dera Baba Gurinder Singh Dhillon, keeping in mind the coming elections. ''The dera has quite a recognisable following and had always been the attraction for political parties. There could be no denying political overtones of the visit,'' said Jagroop Singh Sekhon, a Reader in the Department of Political Science, Guru Nanak Dev University, here. Sekhon, who has extensively studied the deras and their political affliations, also confirmed that the dera funtionaries had been supporting candidates in the elections time and again. He said they sit atop a highly composite vote bank. Sonia, who took a round of the dera, expressed satisfaction over the visit and fully appreciated the discipline and the dedication of the devotees at the dera, said Amarinder. She also inaugurated an annual eye camp, he added. -------------------------------- Internet posts on Satsangis Does it (RS) manifest better life choices, strenghten healthy relationships, wisdom, kindness, clarity of mind....a host of healthy attributes actualized in ones life ? Absolutely not from my exposure to hundreds of individuals who have ardently practiced various forms of chasing after inner phenomenon. CTD -----------------I know satsangis who are terrible...who lie, cheat, steal, who beat their wives, have incestual relationships with their daughters, go to jail for drunk driving, etc, etc. They were all initiated. Bertha --------------------------------  |